Jorge Serrano is a former president of Guatemala, a businessman, an evangelical Christian. And in our meeting in Panama, it struck me that even conservatives and capitalists spoke with some touch of respect for Fidel Castro. I asked him why.

Where do you meet with Fidel?

“On two occasions. Once in Mexico, in Guadalajara, and another time in Spain.”

Did you like him personally?

“First meeting was, you know, he was very impressive, because Fidel, when you talk to him, he is charming, he has a strong personality, but very open. He had respect for me because he always recognized that I kept an independent course. He was following me since I was one of the members of the National Reconciliation Commission, the national body promoting the peace accords. So, I had some indirect communication with him. But the first direct meeting was in Guadalajara.”

President Serrano talked to Fidel about his efforts at ending the thirty year civil war, and asked him to be a positive influence with the guerillas.

Fidel agreed. “I am going to help you. I don’t have too much influence in Guatemala, but I am going to speak to them. And he did. He helped me. At least they knew that the opinion of Fidel was going to be in my favor.

“At that time, he was explaining all the liberties in Cuba, and talked about religion. I said, oh Fidel, if it is so, I would like to send some Bibles to Cuba. If I can send them, let me how can I do that?”

“How many Bibles?” Fidel asked.

“Half a million.”

“OH, CHICO!! You want to evangelize all the island. Why, so many?”

Serrano answered, “Exactly for the same reason that you were sending propaganda to Latin America.”

Somebody called Serrano from the ministry of foreign affairs and told him that President Castro said that he can send the first ten thousand Bibles. “So I made all the connections to the Bible societies. And then the ministry said, you are going to give us the Bibles to distribute. And I said no, I am going to send the Bibles to somebody to distribute. I came to send thirty thousand, a big difference (from a half million), but it was OK.”

It’s interesting to me that, you are a capitalist, and a Christian, and Fidel is neither, and yet it seems that even those who oppose his ideology or history have appreciation or  respect for him at some level.

“I told my wife we were going to meet him. And my wife said no. Look at what he has done to my country. I am not going to meet with him. But I said it was a piece of history. After 20 minutes with Fidel, she was laughing and they were best friends.

“In Madrid, some of the presidents of Latin America had a meeting. And President Felipe Gonzalez, instead of having the seats in the usual way, they put the seats in the round. So all the presidents had the opportunity to be seeing each other. Then Castro gets into the room and the Paraguayan president gets into the room and they sit across from each other.

“When I come into the room, Fidel says, Serrrano come sit here. I sat with him and started to talk. So, in order to pass the time, Fidel asks the Paraguayan President, “How many hectares do you have?”

He answered, twenty.

Fidel said, “Oh, but that is a minimum!”

“Twenty THOUSAND.”

Fidel laughed, “Oh, Chico you are a lacayo (a servant of the imperialists)!”

Felipe Gonzales said, “And you Fidel, what are you talking about, you have a complete island!”

Fidel said, “Yes, but I cannot sell it, and I am not selling it!”

Why do you think Fidel didn’t liberalize after some years?

“Ah, I asked him. You know there was a meeting with the presidents of Mexico, Colombia and Bolivia  and they got together in Vera Cruz, because at that time there was a rumor that the Americans were going to try to start a conflict over the bases in order to get into Cuba.

“The meeting was a disaster. After the problem was presented, after twenty minutes, Fidel stands up, and asks all his people to get ready and go back to the island. He cut all communication with these presidents. So the president of Venezuela called me and said, Jorge, Fidel Castro appreciates you, so we would like to ask you to talk to him. We need to open his eyes because a bloodbath can come to Cuba.”

Which year was this?

“1992-1993.

“So the next day, I saw Fidel in a reception, and I said I need to talk to you alone. He said, let’s do it in Barcelona, because we were going there for the inaugural ceremony of the Olympic Games.

“I was resting in the hotel before the inauguration, and a knock comes on my door, and I was told President Castro is available if you have the time. I told Fidel we are really worrying about this situation because it will cause a real problem for Latin American countries. He listened. He was not alone, as I asked, there were two guys, one from the government party and the other from foreign affairs.

“Fidel said, ‘Serrano, I accept your concerns. Because it is from you and not from one of these servants of the imperialists. But I am going to live with the revolution, and I am going to die with the revolution. I am not going to be like (Ceaucescu of Romania). If I open the door THIS much, they are going to get in, and destroy the revolution. So the revolution will continue till I die or I die with the revolution.'”

I am the son of a New York City cab driver and a Californian with a convertible. So, buses are not my thing. My last regular experience with buses was as a teenager. In our Brooklyn neighborhood, you needed a bus to get to the #3 IRT subway. When we moved to Long Island, I rode the school bus to Oceanside High. So, the decades old “chicken buses” I rode in Guatemala, Nicaragua and Panama felt familiar for a good reason: I rode in them forty years ago.

Blue Bird has been making school buses since 1927. Coincidentally, during my travels through Central America, the company was sold to Hennessy Capital for $500 million. You know a Blue Bird by their distinctive design, and in these parts by the English language safety signs in otherwise all espanol buses.

“Chicken buses” were named, as legend goes, by an intrepid “Lonely Planet” writer. I find the term a little condescending. The origin of the name comes from two phenomena: people are packed in like livestock, and sometimes, riders bring along their livestock.

I promised friends and family that I would opt for safe travel and risked breaking that promise my first morning of the trip. My airbnb host Marco offered a list of places to see upon my arrival in Guate (local slang for Guatemala City). I didn’t take my iPad or iPhone as I wanted to sort out the safety issues, so I trusted my instincts to find my way around. No map. No GPS. No web access. Virtually no street signs. And calle 10 or Avenida 6 in Zona 1 were entirely different streets in Zona 9. I quickly got lost, but it was a Saturday, I had no appointments, and I love getting to know a city by wandering.

I jumped on the modest 1 Quetzal (US$0.13) metro light rail after a few hours walk and then looked for a bus back as it started raining. Oddly, the less comfy and more dangerous chicken buses, or camionetas, cost double the metro. In Panama, they are called “diablo rojos,” or “red devils.” As in, they are painted red. And, as in, riding them might be your straight shot to hell.

How dangerous are the buses? Let’s put aside, for the moment, mad speeds and rollicking driving styles, the roiling mass of humanity that fills the vehicles, the frequent breakdowns, the strain on parts built when Nixon was still claiming Watergate was no big deal.

How dangerous? This dangerous. Over 900 Guatemalan bus drivers have been murdered driving these buses for refusing extortion demands by the maras, or local gangs. After the 1954 CIA overthrow of the country’s second democratically elected president Jacobo Arbenz Guzman, a thirty-five year civil war claimed an estimated 200,000 lives, many brutally murdered, sometimes in mass killings. After the civil war ended, many of the government militia entered the narco trafficking and extortion rackets. The genesis of a culture of violence.

The buses are colorful. Not colorful as in, a nice coat of paint, but colorful as in rolling works of art, with intricate designs, sometimes sacred, sometimes profane, sometimes glorifying the driver, sometimes an eye-popping psychedelic theme. The Panamanian buses seem to have more personal themes. The designs are a badge of honor and pride for the owner/drivers.

My effort at poor Spanish brought jeers from the brocha as I boarded. The drivers have a sidekick, part money changer, part master of ceremonies, part barker. The brochas often hang by their fingernails out the open front or rear door of the bus, screaming at people on the street, at fifty miles an hour, promoting the destination and the urgent opportunity to hop aboard. The buses will stop anywhere for a fare, bringing the speeding bundle of loose bolts, worn tires and rickety windows to a screeching stop in seconds on any highway. Other drivers rarely seem to mind. If they do, they lean on their horns. Two things I noticed. The relentless, aggressive use of horns. And the ever present smell of exhaust fumes. Think environmental regulations have not made a difference in New York or LA? Your memory is not serving you well.

The brocha answers my broken Spanish questions in, well, Spanish. I have only a general idea where I’m headed, unsure how to describe it, but I decide to just board and see where I end up. They appear to be going in the general direction of my temporary home. The bus is filling up so I can’t choose seats based on comfort or distance from the front, i.e., extortion shooting avoidance.

In the front, above the windshield, the bus declares it is number 1329. I suspect that more likely means the 1,329th bus in the New York public school system, than any local numbering system.

The seats are badly battered (naugahyde?).The Pull Down For Ventilation sign above us is being ignored, either because of language comprehension or because the escape/ventilation hatch is long broken. I try to write, but my bad handwriting is made unreadable by the bouncing motion and sudden stops. The intense fumes are actually pleasant, in the way glue-sniffing might hold charm for a junkie. The loud, nervous engine grinds gears.

As we go through what-neighborhood-I’m-not-sure, the streets are coming alive. It’s about 4pm on a Saturday. The afternoon sky is growing darker, as it does most days here, making way for a light sprinkle. Another phenomenon– each driver pumps furiously loud music into the bus. If he’s a Pentecostal, with Jesus bumper stickers slapped all over the bus, and violent scenes of crucifixion or the Apocalypse on the exterior, it’s nonstop, upbeat preaching. If he’s a hip hop fan, you might get lurid misogyny in English or Spanish. Mostly, it’s Latino country music, “melting underwear” music as Brazilians call it. I get off on Calle 10, and walk in the direction of  Oakland Mall, Guate’s upscale shopping pavilion, asking for directions along the way.

That’s Kevin to the left. He was wearing a University of Oregon T-shirt, sitting at the next table on the marina in Livingston, Guatemala when we struck up a conversation.

Traveling by bus offers harrowing moments, especially when your Spanish is pathetic, and the bus schedules and locations are confusing. On my last day in Guatemala, I travel from Livingston on the Caribbean side through the country to Guate, and hope to find an all night diner where I can hang out, drink coffee and write, then collapse on the bus for the long ride through El Salvador, Honduras and Nicaragua. The “executivo” bus promises wifi and electrical outlets, essential for my long trip. What the bus brochure meant was there was a rumor of wifi and electrical outlets, and please, please, my friend, please don’t count on it. Climbing on a bus for a 12 hour ride with dead batteries and no wifi is far more dangerous to my well being than a ride on a chicken bus.

So, I arrive in Guatemala City, down the road that President Arbenz wanted to build to compete with the United Fruit railroad, and I ask my taxi driver for an all night diner or bar or cafe. “No such thing in Guatemala,” he assures me. So, I reluctantly go the traditionalist route and asked him to take me to a hotel. My Afterparty budget is $60 a day all in, including transport, so if I can’t get away with a night without hotel expense, I ask if there is a hotel under $30. “No problem, poco. poco” he assures me, and even promises to come get me at 5am to take me to the bus station. We pass the Conquistador Hotel on the way, and I ask him to let me pop in for a quote. Too expensive. By the way, why would a hotel think it was attractive to name itself after Spanish soldiers who swept through Guatemala slaughtering and occupying villages in their path? I am discouraged from asking such questions.

I finally find the hotel and–great news! They not only have a room, but they rent by the hour! No, scratch that. By the half hour. Who said romance is dead!?!

Traveling on a tight budget offers its own titillation, trying to stretch dollars to achieve the mission.  And, sometimes, extreme deprivation or freak show circumstances provide comic relief. The picture to the right is my room. It had wifi! I got on Facebook and chatted with LiAnne. I showed her the room. The bed, the bars on the door (I had the first floor room by the entrance. Like a honeymoon suite, if on your honeymoon, your partner is a sexual predator).  I buy snacks from the receptionist (pimp?) with some (free!!) vile coffee as a sort of exclusive dining experience.

Amazingly, the taxi driver shows up at 5am, knocking on my door like an impatient family member wanting to get to Disneyland. He drops me in the middle of nowhere, a dark empty Guate street. It looks like it MIGHT be a bus station. There are no buses. He asks the security guy. Yup, get out, you’re here.

And there, in front of the station, stand two gringos. One is a vagabond from Los Angeles. And the other is Kevin. Kevin! My Kevin! We met at my hotel (hostel? hovel?) in Livingston and hung out together.  I was so happy. Kevin gave me contact information for an ex-Salvadoran guerrilla who has a little hotel on Lake Nicaragua. We talk about war and travel and buses.

The bus station opens and we buy our tickets. No wifi or electricity, but I’m happy for now, as we head off for El Salvador.

I met Rod Diaz at a lunch with former Guatemalan President Jorge Serrano at the elegant Edificio Capital Plaza in Panama City. I was fascinated by Rod’s intimate stories of former Panamanian head of state Omar Torrijos. We agreed to meet again, and did, several days later in his office.

Rodrigo Díaz Paredes is Panamanian political history incarnate. He begins by revealing the stunning history of his family. Chiseled, handsome features, athletic and toned, with masterful use of language to emphasize, persuade and seduce, he looks like a Latin Rod Serling. He is dressed in a dark suit, with an open neck, pressed white dress shirt.  He sits at the front of our finely polished conference table.

“My family has been involved in Panama life since our foundations as a republic. On my father’s side, General Domingo Diaz was second in command of Battalon Colombia, the battalion that was here. He led the liberal party so he was key in the process of independence from Colombia. On my mother’s side was Panama’s first head of government. When Panama became independent, there was a junta and my two great-grandfathers were part of that junta. Both great-grandfathers  became president. One of my grandfathers was governor of the second largest province of the country and my other grandfather was in the Assembly and his brother was vice president.”

You have a lot of work to do to live up to that.

“My father was General Torrijo’s best friend and right hand man. He headed the negotiation process for the Panama Canal treaties. There was a book that came out about the negotiating process.  The U.S. head negotiator said of my father in referencing their first meeting, “He was brusque, he was rough and had no diplomatic abilities.”

Was he like that way at home?

Rod smiles. “He was a military man. He went to U.S. military school when he was seven years old. He graduated from Georgetown. He and my grandfather established in 1962-63 the first satellite telecommunications company in Latin America. On October 1, 1968, a new government came into power; they were brought down on October 11. In that process, they tried to retire General Torrijos and they tried to take away my father’s very prosperous business. That same day Torrijos met with the commander-in-chief, the head of the Panamanian military structure. said the government had changed. Torrijos was forty and my father was thirty years old, and they led a coup.”

Tell me, how does a coup happen?

“In Panama, the climate was perfect for it. That president, it was his third time he was thrown out of office.  He had proven to be very irresponsible. He had very radical positions.”

Radical in terms of left wing. Or as in extreme policies?

“He was extreme right in the sense that he was a racist, an open racist. He believed that blacks had to be neutered and said it openly. Torrijos was a military man that came from a family in the interior of the country, from high school professors, a teaching family, and he strongly believed that Panama needed the opportunity to create social equality. For that to happen, it had to be done from the highest part of the government. The beauty of it is that, his life was all about that. He also believed there was a lot of corruption in the government that had to be attacked head on. He also believed the Canal had to be returned.

“Panama since our independence from Colombia had lived under the U.S. military presence. Imagine having Soviet tanks going down Pennsylvania Avenue. That’s what we had. Usually coups are not done by Generals. Torrijos was a Lieutenant Colonel and was the executive officer at the central HQ of the army. He got the support of the junior officers, mostly majors, and captains and lieutenants.”

Scenes from the 1989 United States Invasion of Panama Called Operation Just Cause

You were young at the time. How did Panamanians react?

“Of course at the beginning, there was concern. He got the support of his forces by presenting his ideas. Because he worked hand in hand with them for many, many years. He was educated in one of the most prestigious academies, and trained in the U.S. and Europe.  He came from an intellectual family, he educated himself on the ideas that he had, and he got the support of the officers saying, you know what, Panama deserves a lot better. We deserve equality. We deserve integrity. We deserve sovereignty. With that idea, they went forward to the process.

“There was a major event that sparked that. Panama and the U.S. government had agreed that the Panamanian flag was going to be raised within the Canal Zone in specific areas, and the U.S. was not complying with that. In 1964, January 9th, a bunch of students climbed the fence, went in, there was a major event, and  21 students lost their lives. Torrijos, one of his responsibilities was to calm the people. He said, it’s so contradictory, if I am going to be fighting with them against this oppression, how can I stop them?

“That sparked a major nationalistic movement. He was a leader, he was very charismatic. He said, you know what, guys, this government is going to take the country even farther right, where we will deviate even more from our objectives as a nation.”

Was there a sense around that time that it’s time for an end to this tradition of right wing military governments, with officers often paid by the U.S. government. it’s time for this to end? 1968 was a time of student riots in France, anti-war protests in the U.S. Was there some rising tide in the region, that we want to do things differently?

“Oh, without a doubt, you had movements all over the region but Panama was the first one to make that step forward. Torrijos created a mechanism for educating and creating a middle class. At the time there were extreme left-wing guerrillas in Colombia, Nicaragua, Guatemala, El Salvador, but Torrijos was neither right nor left, so you had none of that. His saying was, ‘Never the right, never the left, only Panama.’”

What was the relationship between Torrijos and Noriega?

“At that time, Noriega was a captain and worked for Torrijos. Very smart, studied in Peru, then was head of intelligence, went to the U.S. School of the Americas with elite intelligent officers from all over the world, the Mossad.”

Former CIA asset, Panamanian head of intelligence, head of state, narco trafficker and arms dealer Manuel Noriega, overthrown in the 1989 U.S. invasion, then imprisoned in Florida.

Did his colleagues know he was a CIA informant?

“No, they did not know. I imagine the U.S. identified his weaknesses, his desire for resources, for the fine things in life. In his first year, he proved to be a very good asset and kept order in the ranks. That allowed Torrijos to spend a lot of time out of Panama getting international support (for the Canal treaty).”

So no one suspected Noriega was a CIA asset?

“Toward the end Torrijos had questions but was not sure. There was a coup against Torrijos. Noriega was essential in allowing him a safe return.  Torrijos was in Mexico when they advanced on him. They tried bringing him back through Costa Rica where they were going to kill him. So he went in via El Salvador where he had many ties with his former academy friends, now in high places in the military. The airport didn’t have lights. So, my uncle and other family members pointed their cars toward the runway and turned on the headlights.”

“Great movie scene. At what point did he go from being an asset to being a problem?”

“Noriega played a major role for the U.S. because he kept a relationship with the guerrillas in Columbia and left-wing movements in Central and South America. He was in charge of providing funding for the contras in Nicaragua from drug trafficking in Columbia.”

“You know that Ronald Reagan did creative things with the Iran contra deal. Was Noriega freelancing with the U.S. looking the other way, or were they supporting it?”

“The information that we have here was that it was well aware that one of his responsibilities was to manage the drug trafficking so that xyz movement is allowed, but not the rest, so they are contained. He also got resources to fund some of his operations. At one point, he got the hang of it. The problem was he enjoyed it, he thought, if I am doing 100, why not do 150, then 200? And then it kept growing and growing.

“He kept informing for the CIA in the scope of his responsibilities and then he went out for himself. He funded the guerrillas, left-wing movements, the Sandinistas, because he was also an arms dealer. He was working with everybody. At the end of the day, he sold to the devil and anyone who was there for him to do business with.”

I laughed, “He was a great capitalist.”

“There is a book by a writer called John Perkins.”

“Economic Hit Man.”

“Yes, when Torrijos died, my father was supposed to be on that plane. My younger brother had meningitis. Lost his hearing. Torrijos said, go ahead, be with your family. I’ll meet you at the beach house.”

That was purely a mechanical failure, not sabotage?

“Noriega was not next in line. There was Torrijos, then Flores then Paredes.   Then Noriega. That specific plane had just come back from maintenance.  There was speculation about several things. One.  There was a case of sodas that came in at the last minute that was not checked by security – that invited a lot of question marks about Noriega. Two, within the control systems, there was a release of a gas that makes people fall asleep, there was speculation that that happened. One of Noriega’s security heads told me once that there was guy in a bar, he was drunk and he said that he had orders from Noriega’s people to get to the site first. He got there first, and he killed everyone. And that guy was murdered a week later. (The guy I talked to) was one of the heads of security for Noriega and very well informed.”

Omar Torrijos

Tell me about the moment that the U.S. said, this guy is out of control.

“Going back, there has to be motive, what are the interests. When Torrijos was doing his process to get support for the Canal treaties, of course he went to the world. When he did that, he became not only a Panamanian leader, but a Latin American leader, admired by the world. Because he lived what he preached. There was a U.S. photographer that had been taking pictures of Reagan and he came to Panama. And I’ll tell you a story, it’s a great story. Tom Zimboroff, he was from California, he came to Panama and was here for a couple of weeks without having a chance to meet with General Torrijos. So he found out that there was a press conference at his beach house. He could not get an interview because Torrijos did not like to give interviews. Everybody left and all of a sudden the helicopter started spinning, and he said, well, this is my chance. He got into the back of the helicopter, strapped himself in. A few minutes later my father went into the helicopter and General Torrijos came in, and security and they left. I’ll show you a picture how they always sat one in front of the other. And they were talking. All of a sudden, Torrijos looks at Tom and says, ‘Who the hell is that guy??’ And my father says, I don’t know. And so they asked him, who are you. And Tom explained. And Torrijos said, you know what, you know I have to say, you have a lot of guts. I have two options here.”

One is to kill you.

One is to kill you and throw you out of the helicopter for violating security. You want to talk to me?  I admire people with bravery and guts. So, if you want to document this, let’s go, let’s do it. So he spent most of 76 and 77 traveling the world with him. Took 18,000 pictures. We have the pictures. My father kept the original minutes of all those meetings. So we have pictures and minutes and will put together a book.

“Tom spoke to me one day and said when Reagan was running for the presidency, a lot of his speeches were against the treaties. So General Torrijos sent a message to Reagan through Tom and said you don’t know me, let’s get together and suggested they meet. And Reagan sent back a message that I never am going to meet with that tin horn general.

“In ‘Confessions of an Economic Hit Man’, Perkins mentions that in 1981, Jaime Roldos, the president of Ecuador died in a very mysterious plane crash. And in the book he suggests that the only two heads of state that he met that never kneeled down to the U.S. global empire were Torrijos and Roldos. And for that they paid with their lives.

“I had a chance to speak with a relative of Roldos here, a very smart man, and he was 100% convinced that it happened that way and had a lot of evidence and information as to why that was true.

“Motive once again. One of the things the U.S. was trying to achieve was to leave military installations here in Panama. And under Torrijos that would never happen. When 2000 came and the Canal was reverted, there had been negotiations at the U.S.’s initiative to put multi-lateral drug centers under the control of the U.S. military. I imagine that when we say where is the motive, preserving the asset, preserving the strategic position for the U.S. Southern Command, Noriega was feeding the U.S. information about Torrijos’ intentions, about the situation going out of control for the U.S., how Torrijos was getting way too much international support.”

The non-aligned movement.

“Torrijos had a plan, an open plan, that he asked the Assembly that he be granted head of state powers between 1972 and 1978 with one mission, to return the Canal. When that was concluded, the process began for return to civilian administration. So, between 1972 and 1978, there were elections, not selected by everyone, by a selected group, 505 members of the community, intellectuals, people who really knew their job, and the next step was to have general elections. That meant military people who were in power would be reduced. A lot of people pushed Torrijos to run for the presidency and Torrijos said no, I have to set the example. I have to go back to the barracks so that the army can follow me. If not, how am I going to tell anyone else to go back to the barracks. That meant for Noriega, and all his group, there was not going to be a succession plan. They would go back to being everyday military men.”

How did Noriega rise to power?

In 81, Paredes was a lieutenant colonel. He never, out of respect for Torrijos, wanted to become a general. He was more an executive. He was very easily taken out. Paredes had a strong control of the government, Noriega was his right hand man.  Noriega, very smart guy that he is, he convinced Paredes to retire, and to run in open elections in 1984 with the support of the party and the support of the military.  In that way he would gain legitimacy, control everything and continue the process that Torrijos had envisioned.”

Sounds good.

“Sounds good. When he announced his retirement, there is a famous speech that said, ‘Good job, my general.'” Rod wipes his hands. “From that day on, Noriega proclaimed himself general, gained control of the armed forces, we did have elections, the winner was not Paredes, but instead a former world bank VP for Latin America, a University of Chicago-educated, very smart guy, who served for a couple of years until he said I can’t do this any more. He stepped down.

“In 1987, you had a major event. A left wing doctor Hugo Spadafora who fighting in Nicaragua came to Panama to announce that Noriega was doing all this drug trafficking with the contras, and Noriega’s guys intercepted him and he was murdered and decapitated.

“In 1987, Noriega’s right hand man turned on him and made public Noriega’s participation in drugs. That became a major crisis. The crisis was building up to the point that the U.S. decides, this guy is out of control.  Every day there is more intrigue. Taking him out with a Navy SEALS team would have been very simple. But with an invasion, taking out the entire structure was sending a message. And that happened 10 years before the final Canal handoff. I imagine they said, if this guy is doing that now, when he gets control of the Canal, there is going to be chaos. If it is going to be left in Panamanian hands, it is going to be under conditions that are acceptable. And at the same time with a civilian administration that we can try to negotiate the terms for the drug interdiction center. He knew a lot of things about George Bush. It was just ’88, and Bush just became President. Noriega held A LOT of information. ”

Meaning, George Bush wanted to…

“…silence him. A lot of information.”

So, George Bush is head of the CIA, Reagan’s Vice President, and then President, ten years before the handover of the Canal, plus out of control narco trafficking, plus the Canal situation, handed over against Reagan’s objections, with this guy in power, the Canal is in jeopardy.

“The canal was in jeopardy.”

“There were two coups in 1989. The second came out poorly for eighteen officers.”

“That’s why I mentioned that taking out the whole structure was part of the idea  When there was a coup against Noriega, the officers had support of the U.S. Southern Command. Everything was coordinated in case Noriega’s supporters regained control. When they called for support, they were told you are on our own.”

Why?

“As I said when you look at motive, if you only dismantle the head of the armed forces, the same structure goes forward and you are not going to get your objective of negotiating conditions where you can leave your base here in Panama.”

So then the key was dismantling the Panamanian Defense Forces and instituting an elected government. That was the strategy?

“Yes. So that they could have a formal counterpart to negotiate with.”

That was a brutal betrayal, to encourage these guys and then leave them hanging, only to get slaughtered.

“Slaughtered.”

Do you think the U.S. told Noriega this was happening?

“I don’t think so.”

So, in conclusion, as a Panamanian, you see that Noriega was taken out, certain things happened that may have had positive outcomes, what is your point of view about ‘Operation Just Cause?’

“I think it was an operation that, propaganda-wise, was great propaganda, that there were very little casualties, very little damage, we liberated a country from this horrible dictator. The reality is that we had a great head of state that had done magnificent things and he was the one that was murdered. We were then left with the inheritance of this monster. Look what he did with the support of the U.S.. Once the U.S. objectives were accomplished, he was no longer needed, so then there was an invasion that killed thousands of innocent people.

“I was in the U.S. with my dad, we were skiing. We had to come into Costa Rica. When we first came into the city, about 10 days after the invasion, the military HQ areas were leveled. The U.S. tried a lot of equipment for the first time in Panama, and they missed targets, and a lot of innocent people died. Since, Panama has been able to rebuild itself by working very hard and setting objectives and thank God, Noriega is out.  But the price and the way…Panama was on its tracks without him. Noriega was forced here by the U.S. I was educated in the U.S., it’s not a matter of education or affinity, it’s how I see things.

You’ve been generous with your time. What advice would you have for U.S. policy in the future as it relates to interventions, as was done in Panama?

“I think every day it is more clear, the U.S. has consistently done the same thing. Noriega was a former ally who became a monster and there a lot of casualties in the middle. You have Saddam Hussein, ally, then a lot of casualties in the middle. Osama bin Laden, an ally, then you have the same. The story repeats itself and I think it’s time the U.S. learns from its mistakes.”

And what is the lesson?

“You have to evaluate what your policy is and how you are going to infiltrate and participate in foreign affairs. If you are going to be a political partner or you are going to be an economic partner, or are you going to try to control what is happening in other countries.”

But, if I may, is there a certain moral principle or foreign policy principal…”

“I think the moral principal is, you create these monsters that then turn on you, and that at the end of the day creates hatred. Thank God, we here in Latin America, we are very passive people, we are mainly of Christian background, forgiving.  But elsewhere in the world, they are more radical. And that is what we are seeing.”

We shake hands, promise to follow up with photos and more information, and Rod adds one last thing.

“You know, the Canal treaties were ratified in the Senate by only one vote. Teddy Kennedy. Torrijos promised that the Canal would be returned to Panama. So, he and my father arranged, and no one else knew, not even the soldiers involved, that if the Canal treat was not ratified, orders were given to blow it up so no one else could have it. Not permanently. Just for two years.”

After a brief pause, I said, “That’s pretty strong.”

Rod holds his hands wide apart and smiles. “Torrijos had huge balls.”

The Panama Canal treaty was negotiated by a Frenchman and an American before Panamanian officials could reach Washington. It was one of many, many grand heists of land from people with far fewer gunships. As Jimmy Carter negotiated a treaty with Panamainian General Omar Torrijos, candidate Ronald Reagan campaigned on a platform of, screw those people, we are not giving it back. Which motivated John Wayne, yes that John Wayne, to weigh in and say the following.

Associated Press. March 16, 1987.

In a letter to Mr. Reagan dated Nov. 11, 1977, a copy of which was sent to Mr. Carter, the actor accused Mr. Reagan of spreading untruths about the Panama Canal Treaty in letters to his supporters.

He signed the letter ”Duke” and enclosed with it a five-page rebuttal – written on the stationery of the Republican National Committee – of Mr. Reagan’s stand on the canal issue.

The treaty was signed and honored.

I meet Jorge Fuentes, Guatemalan congressman, Central American Parliament member, preacher and businessman at the home of Carmen Aida de Fernandez. I had been to the home earlier in the week, where I was invited for Sunday lunch, after I watched her sons and daughter run in the Guatemala City marathon.

Fuentes is dressed in a business suit, and speaks with an energetic, sometimes boisterous style. The voice of an evangelical preacher, which he is. Faith healer, too.

After opening pleasantries and a description of the project, we discuss the Main Event: the 1954 overthrow of democratically elected Guatemalan president Jacobo Arbenz.

Carmen acts as translator, but, in his enthusiasm, Fuentes frequently makes his points in English or performs his own translation. He uses his whole body when he speaks, often waving his arms or slamming things for dramatic effect. He begins with a provocative statement.

“The conditions of the time of Jacobo Arbenz are the same now. I understand that the North American government is the leader of the world. The world needs a leader. It”s a good leader. It has a philosophy of human rights. But the people in the CIA, the State Department, the embassies, their history with countries is not good. Because they partner with military governments and economic interests, so they put aside the interests of the people, as those interests have no value to them.

“Let”s say I am a dominant businessman in Guatemala and I have a problem with the president. And the President has ideas about social issues.” Fuentes knocks over the napkin holder with a wave of his right hand. “People? Bullshit. I will say, “The president is a bad man, a criminal, a communist.” I will talk to the army and give the cue. “Cut him down, he”s a communist.””

Does that still happen today?

“Yes, in Honduras, in many places. I could tell you some stories. OK, we are friends…”

Carmen and Marco hosted Jorge and I in their home in Guatemala City for the meeting.

Jorge reaches to hit the napkin holder again for effect. Carmen Aida objects, grabbing the holder, laughing, “I bought this in Chile!” I put my hand over my glass. “Just leave the water, Jorge.” We laugh, then he continues.

“An American comes and says I want to buy this company at x price. Then he eliminates the president if is not willing to give it to him. This is a real story, a real man, a friend, at 14 years old we went to school together. He had a lot of money. From Nicaragua, from the dictator Anastasio Somoza.”

He takes off his coat and tie.

“These names are in Serrano”s book, the second book. The second best seller in Guatemala. Jacobo Arbenz, he was fighting with commercial interests and they declared he was many things, including communist.”

Was he a communist? And if not, why was he called a communist?

“He took some ideas about redistribution of property. Let me tell you something. I am a businessman and a politician. My family, for many generations, has been in politics. I am trying to give you a bigger vision and Big broken hard drive data recovery is the latest trend to emerge because of these factors. with that vision you can change the names and times, and you will find exactly the same in all of Latin America. This originates in the colonies and the colonies had a certain structure.”

He asks for paper and I give him my notebook. He grabs my red ballpoint pen and furiously draws a diagram.

“The Catholic Church. The government. The economic leaders. The military. That is what you see in every town. If you go to any Central Park, you see this.

“This is the colonial structure. And there are tunnels at that time. The presidential house, the residence of the cardinal.”

I interrupt, “Was this institutional structure inherited from Spain, this close relationship between the military and government?”

He takes my pen again.

“Please keep it,” I laugh. “I bought a package on the bus for twenty five cents. They”re not very good.”

“They make an understanding between the military, the church, and the government. The church is looking out for the people, but the people do not have the power. The political sector is relegated, because the military sector commands the government, and the church looks to both the people and the political elites. The rich families have a good relationship with the cardinal. He is invited to the family parties. And the cardinal says, please give me money for my purse. A little check! His dignity, values, righteousness, everything is affected.”

I say, “And I would think, Jorge, that there would be a theological structure put forward by the cardinal to suggest to the masses that this system is the will of God. Even in Arbenz” times, there was a religious component to anti-communism. Godless, atheistic communism.”

Jorge answers, “I am Christian, and I am a preacher. I am full of the Holy Spirit. I pray for people to be healed. I love my Lord, He is the first place in my heart.

“The Catholic Church was the only church by law in many Latin American countries. We had a university founded years before the U.S. People, Creole people, began to think and to protest. President Rufino Barrios put out all the nuns and priests, throws them out of Guatemala. He put out the properties of the church. The church had too many properties, got too rich. He was a reformer.”

“That”s pretty strong.”

Carmen Aida adds, “He closed all the convents. He started in 1871. Barrios built La Reforma Avenue (a central, tree-lined downtown street).”

Fuentes: “At this moment, there is a revolution and they proclaim freedom of religion. Many countries did not have that. Guatemala started this. Then the church returns to Guatemala but they come like a dog with their tail between their legs. They lost their money, their power, their influence.”

“What did the powerful Catholic families think about this?”

Fuentes shrugged. “There was a revolution, obviously, and it affected the politicians and the military. Then the power increased in this triangle (economic, military, religious elites). The political sector came to have very little power. The economic sector put the military officers in the government. We had this for many years.”

“What is your sense of United Fruit in the fifties? You talked about economic elites. United Fruit was a powerful company.”

“Guatemala was not a banana country. It has rich land. United Fruit had a strong position. But not as powerful as in banana countries like Honduras.”

I ask, “But Arbenz wanted agrarian reform and wanted to buy unused land from the company at the (undervalued) price that United Fruit paid as valuation for taxes. And United Fruit went to Washington and asked for an intervention. Weren”t they a significant factor?”

“Nah. United Fruit promoted another level of agriculture. They gave good salaries and promoted people. Nobody paid the salaries like the Americans, in any area that you looked. Communism, this is a phantom, a fantasy. Not real.”

“Fantasy? I think the Americans were legitimately concerned about communism in 1954.”

“Well. Let me explain something. Fidel Castro and Che Guevara were living here in Guatemala. They were promoting a liberation army. The initial guerrillas were military men who they saw that the officers were subservient to the economic sector.

“In my personal opinion, the business sector of the U.S. was responsible for Castro. Cuba was the destination for cheap casinos, liquor, for tourists from the U.S. The military from the U.S. betrayed the Cuban military. The U.S. sent the military to rescue the soldiers in Cuba. The military then received a contrary order. The government wanted to have a crisis in Cuba because the tourism industry in the U.S. wanted to hurt Cuba.

“I came to Christianity with a Cuban pastor named Victor Toranzo, who was one of the two ministers who supported Castro and the revolution. The original revolution used the imagery of the Virgin Mary and the cross and the bible, because it was about the rescue of morality, of the economy and of the liberty of Cuba. Because the North American interests and investors and tourism turned Cuba into a cabaret. They said, we need to be free of these influences, their money, their boot on our neck.”

“What happened when Cuba became communist?”

“When Castro doesn”t receive support from the U.S., the Russians come to help him and he shakes their hand.”

“Was he Marxist before that?”

“No no no no no. He has Marxist ideas, these ideas were the moda, the fashion of these times. The modern thinking was liberty, socialism… everybody, all young people were talking about that. Everybody. The anti-communist leader of Guatemala, he was at one time working in these social movements. I was a deputy with him in the Central American parliament. The revolution of Castro was a revolution of freedom from the influence of the United States.”

Part two of the interview, on the emergence of narco trafficking and it”s effect on Guatemala, will be posted soon, along with an interview in Panama with Fuentes uncle and former president Jorge Serrano.